Learning Irish Lessons 11-14

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  • #37050
    Mártan Ó G
    Participant

    Dia daoibh a chairde,

    I’m back studying Irish using Ó Siadhail’s Learning Irish and have a few question about lessons 11-14, specifically regarding the copula. Hopefully someone will be able to shed some light on this.

    1. Regarding the choice of pronouns as the subject of a copular sentence, are the following translations correct?

    Is mé an dochtúr – I am the doctor (and not the teacher)
    (Is) mise an dochtúr – I am the doctor (and that other guy isn’t)

    Is é an dochtúr é – He’s the doctor (He’s not the teacher)
    (Is) eisean an dochtúr – He’s the doctor (not his brother)

    2. Ó Siadhail translates:

    Is é [color=blue]an fear sin[/color] an sagart — [color=blue]That man[/color] is the priest
    Is í [color=blue]Cáit[/color] mo bhean — [color=blue]Cáit[/color] is my wife
    Is iad [color=blue]Bríd agus Máirtín[/color] na gasúir — [color=blue]Bríd and Máirtín[/color] are the children

    (I’ve added the colour myself)

    According to the site nualeargas, the order for copula sentences is copula – predicate – subject. The sentences above seem to be exceptions?

    3. In chapter 11 we see:

    Is í sin mo bhean. — That woman is my wife.

    Later in chapter 14 we see seo, sin and siúd used in sentences like the following:

    Seo í Cáit, sin é Máirtín agus siúd iad na daoine eile.

    Now he doesn’t explicitly say so, but my hunch is that this use of seo/sin/siúd has to do with the copula? If so, do the following mean the same thing, or is there some nuance I’m missing?

    Sin í mo bhean = Is í sin mo bhean
    Ab ‘in í mo bhean? = Ab í sin mo bhean?

    Go raibh míle maith agaibh!

    #46339
    Labhrás
    Participant


    1. Regarding the choice of pronouns as the subject of a copular sentence, are the following translations correct?

    Is mé an dochtúr – I am the doctor (and not the teacher)
    (Is) mise an dochtúr – I am the doctor (and that other guy isn’t)

    Is é an dochtúr é – He’s the doctor (He’s not the teacher)
    (Is) eisean an dochtúr – He’s the doctor (not his brother)

    Yes, they are correct.


    2. Ó Siadhail translates:

    Is é [color=blue]an fear sin[/color] an sagart — [color=blue]That man[/color] is the priest
    Is í [color=blue]Cáit[/color] mo bhean — [color=blue]Cáit[/color] is my wife
    Is iad [color=blue]Bríd agus Máirtín[/color] na gasúir — [color=blue]Bríd and Máirtín[/color] are the children

    (I’ve added the colour myself)

    According to the site nualeargas, the order for copula sentences is copula – predicate – subject. The sentences above seem to be exceptions?

    Yes, they are exceptions.
    Demonstrative adjectives/pronouns and proper names usually come first (in identification sentences).


    3. In chapter 11 we see:

    Is í sin mo bhean. — That woman is my wife.

    Later in chapter 14 we see seo, sin and siúd used in sentences like the following:

    Seo í Cáit, sin é Máirtín agus siúd iad na daoine eile.

    Now he doesn’t explicitly say so, but my hunch is that this use of seo/sin/siúd has to do with the copula? If so, do the following mean the same thing, or is there some nuance I’m missing?

    Sin í mo bhean = Is í sin mo bhean
    Ab ‘in í mo bhean? = Ab í sin mo bhean?

    There’s a subtle nuance in meaning.
    Is í sin … is just a statement.

    Sin í … is more presenting or pointing at, like French voicí (seo é /í …) or voilà (sin é/í …) or Latin ecce
    Ecce homo = Siúd é an duine. (English: behold the man)

    It has to do with the copula though both forms are considered copula sentences nowadays.
    Originally, Sin í … wasn’t a copula phrase but was preceded by a truncated verb form acc (> ag) meaning “look” (French and Latin forms originally mean “look”, too)
    Ag sin mo bhean = Look there: my wife. > There is my wife.

    At present, “ag” is usually lost and Sin í mo bhean is considered a copula sentence with a past form B’in í mo bhean.

    #46341
    Mártan Ó G
    Participant

    That’s a great help! Go raibh maith agat, a Labhráis.

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