- This topic has 13 replies, 1 voice, and was last updated 11 years, 6 months ago by
.
-
Posts
-
I’m working on my next painting (one of an uilleann piper). I’d like to call it “The Piper At The Gates Of Dawn,” but I’m not sure the correct way to render it with the double genitive and whatnot. Are any of these correct?
an píobaire ag geataí na breactha
an píobaire ag geataí na breacadh
an píobaire ag geataí breactha an lae
an píobaire ag geataí breacadh an laeGRMA
I think this one: “an píobaire ag geataí breacadh an lae”
But the concept feels clunky in Irish because “breacadh an lae” is describing an action and teh gates ofg an action don’t really make sense,
Do you need the Gate metaphor? Otherwise how about
An Píobaire ag Fáinne an Lae”?
Or use maidneachan
http://potafocal.com/Metasearch.aspx?Text=maidneachan&GotoID=focloirbeag
An Píobaire ag Geataí an Mhaidneachain
Hm. I’m going for the Pink Floyd reference, so it’s got to be “piper at the gates of dawn.” Is there another word that would be acceptable for “daybreak” or “dawn” or maybe (as a last resort) “sunrise” that would function as a noun instead of a verb?
Yes! Maidneachan
Or Camhaoir but that is rarer
http://potafocal.com/Metasearch.aspx?Text=camhaoir&GotoID=focloirbeag
so perhaps
“an píobaire ag geataí na mhaidneachain” (it is na and not an there with the genitive, right?)
No. Maidneachan is masculine so the article stays as “an” (but the séimhiú is wrong, sorry)
An Píobaire ag Geataí an Maidneachain
Super. I think I like that one the best, but before I commit, what would be the shading on the difference in meaning between maidneachan and camhaoir?
I only know camhaoir from the dictionary – maidneachan is not used often either since “breacadh an lae” or “éirí na greine” is commoner – but maidneachan is fairly obvious.
No. Maidneachan is masculine so the article stays as “an” (but the séimhiú is wrong, sorry)
An Píobaire ag Geataí an Maidneachain
Sorry, Aonghus, but shouldn’t it be “ag Geataí an Mhaidneachain” with séimhiú on “maidneachain”, since masculine nouns normally take séimhiú in the genitive case?
Damn.
I knew I should have gone with my first gut instinct. I will defer to better knowledge . When I try to think about grammar I foul up. I normally work on (neo)native instinct and don’t get things too badly wrong.
Ná bíodh imní ort, a Aonghus! B’fhearr liom do chuid Gaeilge a bheith agam ná aon eolas ar an ngramadach. 😉
“An maidneachan” is a masculine noun, belonging to the 1st declension. In order to form the genitive, it takes séimhiú on the initial consonant and turns the final broad consonant into a slender one. So the title should read:
“An Píobaire ag Geataí an Mhaidneachain”
For more examples of 1st declension nouns, here’s a link to Lars’ grammar.
http://www.nualeargais.ie/gnag/gram.htm
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.
