Tá ceist agum

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  • #36201
    Aislingeach
    Participant

    “ag troid le chéile” could mean either fighting together against a common enemy or fighting amongst themselves, and the difference would depend on context? Or is there a different way to express one of those concepts?

    GRMA

    #41371
    ridiredubh
    Participant

    “ag troid le chéile” could mean either fighting together against a common enemy or fighting amongst themselves, and the difference would depend on context? Or is there a different way to express one of those concepts?

    GRMA

    ” They were fighting among themselves” would be translated as “Bhí siad ag troid eatarthu féin” Incidently, I notice you spell ”agam”as “agum” Is there a reason?

    #41372
    Marcoman
    Participant

    Incidently, I notice you spell ”agam”as “agum” Is there a reason?

    Southern pronunciation. It is pronounced with the second syllable stressed and short u.

    #41373
    Aislingeach
    Participant


    ” They were fighting among themselves” would be translated as “Bhí siad ag troid eatarthu féin” Incidently, I notice you spell ”agam”as “agum” Is there a reason?

    I ask because I have just started reading Fionn mac Cumhail, Taoiseach na Féinne, le Tadhg Mac Dhonnagáin, for practice, and it says a “Bhí na Fianna ag troid le chéile! Na Fianna!” I took this, contextually, to mean they were fighting amongst themselves, as the High King was unhappy about it. But I have only ever encountered “le chéile” in the context of unity, so I was wondering if “ag troid le chéile” was something that could be interpreted either way, depending on context, or if I was misunderstanding.

    As for my use of “agum” (incidently, also “agut” and “aca”), is fearr liom Gaelainn na Mumhan. Is it wrong to spell them thus?

    GRMA

    #41381
    ridiredubh
    Participant


    ” They were fighting among themselves” would be translated as “Bhí siad ag troid eatarthu féin” Incidently, I notice you spell ”agam”as “agum” Is there a reason?

    I ask because I have just started reading Fionn mac Cumhail, Taoiseach na Féinne, le Tadhg Mac Dhonnagáin, for practice, and it says a “Bhí na Fianna ag troid le chéile! Na Fianna!” I took this, contextually, to mean they were fighting amongst themselves, as the High King was unhappy about it. But I have only ever encountered “le chéile” in the context of unity, so I was wondering if “ag troid le chéile” was something that could be interpreted either way, depending on context, or if I was misunderstanding.

    As for my use of “agum” (incidently, also “agut” and “aca”), is fearr liom Gaelainn na Mumhan. Is it wrong to spell them thus?

    GRMA[/q

    My opinion is that we have a standardized spelling system which is used throughout Ireland in all the communication media and we should stick with it. We don’t use phonetic spelling in English so why in Irish ? ”iontach” is pronounce “úntach” in Munster – so would you spell it as such ! In parts of Donegal the English word “cattle” is pronounced “kettle” but you never see it written as such in the media!

    #41387
    Aislingeach
    Participant

    My opinion is that we have a standardized spelling system which is used throughout Ireland in all the communication media and we should stick with it. We don’t use phonetic spelling in English so why in Irish ? ”iontach” is pronounce “úntach” in Munster – so would you spell it as such ! In parts of Donegal the English word “cattle” is pronounced “kettle” but you never see it written as such in the media!

    Thank you for sharing your opinion. Perhaps I am just a “non-standard” type of person. It is my understanding that “agum,” “agut,” etc., are rather common and accepted dialectal spelling variants. Certainly, I have seen them in print; I didn’t just create them myself. Nor would I render every word phonetically. But where there exists a common dialectal variation in spelling, I prefer to use the dialectal one. Whether such spellings would or would not be used in the media is a moot point; I do not write for the media. Nor have I any interest in debating whether such spellings are right or wrong. That is a subject for linguists. With regard to my personal writings, I am of the opinion that it is a matter of personal choice. And, personally, I prefer dialect to CO. 🙂

    #41389
    Wee_Falorie_Man
    Participant

    An impeccable source has informed me that “ag troid le chéile” can mean “fighting amongst themselves”.

    For example, it’s in the first sentence of this fable from Aesop:

    http://www.corkirish.com/wordpress/archives/2117

    I know Lughaidh addressed this yesterday, but because of the mysterious disappearance of his posts, I thought I should go ahead and mention this for the benefit of anyone who may have missed it.

    #41426
    Séril Báicéir
    Participant

    Wow, Lughaidh’s posts did dissappear…that is STRANGE!

    #41428
    Lughaidh
    Participant

    I wonder who deleted that… it’s not me anyway 🙁

    #41429
    Anonymous
    Inactive

    “le cheile” simple means – with “each other” which also means “fighting among themselves”. I read all 4 books and they’ve been incredibly helpful for my Irish. I bought it with the CD with Tadhg reading the stories. I’d love to find another series like this.

    #41430
    Aislingeach
    Participant

    “le cheile” simple means – with “each other” which also means “fighting among themselves”. I read all 4 books and they’ve been incredibly helpful for my Irish. I bought it with the CD with Tadhg reading the stories. I’d love to find another series like this.

    Yes, I also bought the set, and I anticipate them being a great help. They are just the right level, too. I can understand a lot of it quite easily, but I still need the dictionary and the occasional explanation. Not too easy, not too hard. 🙂

    #41431

    B’fheidir go bhí (an bhfuil “bhí” ceart anseo?) an scéal ró gáirsiúil… GOA

    #41432
    Lughaidh
    Participant

    B’fhéidir go raibh an scéal ròghàirsiùil.

    as “tà” becomes “fuil”, in the past “bhì” becomes “raibh” 🙂 (dependent forms)

    #41433
    Anonymous
    Inactive

    I went through them with several friends on Skype. We would listen to Tadhg read a chapter. You can download it into your iTunes and then listen with your study partner while you’re on a Skype call. Then we read one paragraph to each other through the same chapter we just heard Tadhg reading. Then we would go back and translate with the other person reading the alternate paragraph while the other person translates. It is EXTREMELY helpful. We did this on Skype over the last several months. You can also try to ask each other questions about the chapter after you’ve read it. For example. “Cén fáth a raibh na Fianna ag troid le chéile?” You will learn alot of Irish this way.

    #41434

    B’fhéidir go raibh an scéal ròghàirsiùil.

    as “tà” becomes “fuil”, in the past “bhì” becomes “raibh” 🙂 (dependent forms)

    Ceart go leor. Cheap mé mar sin freisin ar dtús…

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