Fáilte (Welcome) › Forums › General Discussion (Irish and English) › thú vs. tú
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June 3, 2012 at 10:31 pm #36278Riobàrd deMòinbhiolParticipant
Feicfidh mé thu arís amáreach. Why is thú used instead of tú? GRMA RdeM
June 4, 2012 at 12:31 am #42012Wee_Falorie_ManParticipantGood question!
In this case, “I” is the subject and “you” is the object (direct). When “tú” is the object, it changes to “thú”. By the way, “tomorrow” the adverb. :coolsmile:
* edit: This could just be a dialect thing, but I was taught a different word order where “thú” is at the end of the sentence:
Chífead (Feicfidh mé) arís amáireach thú.
June 4, 2012 at 12:36 am #42014Riobàrd deMòinbhiolParticipantGo hiontach, Thanks.
June 4, 2012 at 3:41 am #42016LughaidhParticipantIn Ulster you can also use “tú” as the object.
You’d hear “tchífidh mé amárach thú” as well as “tchífidh mé amárach tú” etc.June 4, 2012 at 4:32 am #42017Wee_Falorie_ManParticipantIn Ulster you can also use “tú” as the object.
And I think thú/tú would normally go at the end of a sentence like “Chífead amáireach thú / tchífidh mé amárach thú”, right?
June 4, 2012 at 11:55 am #42019LughaidhParticipantThat’s right in Ulster. For Munster I’m not sure since they tend to put the pronoun object just after the subject (more than in Ulster).
June 4, 2012 at 1:48 pm #42021Wee_Falorie_ManParticipantFor Munster I’m not sure since they tend to put the pronoun object just after the subject (more than in Ulster).
I just double-checked my “bible” of Munster Irish, i.e., the original Teach Yourself Irish, and here’s what it says (page 48):
Note that a pronoun as object tends to stand at the end of the sentence: Do chailleadar inné sa bhaile mhór é. “They lost it yesterday in town”.
June 4, 2012 at 3:19 pm #42022LughaidhParticipantRight but it doesn’t mean it’s the rule in whole Munster nowadays 🙂
June 4, 2012 at 4:11 pm #42023RdeMParticipantFeicfidh mé thú arís amáreach, is how the sentence is written in a text from Connemarra, Bunrang na Gaeilge.
June 4, 2012 at 9:26 pm #42024Fionlannach FiosrachParticipant*
June 5, 2012 at 12:04 pm #42025Séril BáicéirParticipantNote that a pronoun as object tends to stand at the end of the sentence: Do chailleadar inné sa bhaile mhór é. “They lost it yesterday in town”.
I have seen this in an interview with a man who says that he speaks like those in the Connemara Gaeltacht.
Feicfidh mé thú arís amáreach, is how the sentence is written in a text from Connemarra, Bunrang na Gaeilge.
And I have also seen this as well in many texts. It may come down to personal preference as I believe most speakers (if not ALL) would understand you either way. 🙂
June 5, 2012 at 7:07 pm #42026SeáinínParticipantAn Focal, de réir na Leabhar Ó Siadhail 😉
“When used disjunctively, that is, not as a subject directly following on a verb form, thú, é, í, iad or thusa, eisean, ise, iadsan are used. Mé/mise, muid/muide, sibh/sibhse remain the same.”
And, regarding word order:
Cloisim anois thú. I hear you now.
Tigim thusa anois ach ní thigim iad sin. I understand you now, but I don’t understand those fellows.“When the ordinary form of a pronoun, e.g. thú, is used an adverb or adverbial phrase, e.g. anois, precedes it.” Apparently by “ordinary” here he means a disjuntive, non-emphatic, non-contrast form of the pronoun.
June 5, 2012 at 7:12 pm #42027LabhrásParticipantA pronoun like thú can stand in three positions here:
1) Feicfidh mé thú arís amáireach.
2) Feicfidh mé arís thú amáireach.
3) Feicfidh mé arís amáireach thú.But I wonder if all three have exactly the same meaning or if they are slightly different.
I think that 3) is the most neutral variant without further connotations.
Can I put some emphasis on one of the adverbs by using 1) or 2)?June 9, 2012 at 6:25 pm #42063MarcomanParticipantthú can be a subject as well, if I’m right. is maith liom thú
June 9, 2012 at 6:33 pm #42064LughaidhParticipantYes, but subject of the copula only, and in certain patterns only…
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