Fáilte (Welcome) › Forums › General Discussion (Irish and English) › cúpla abairt
- This topic has 12 replies, 1 voice, and was last updated 10 years ago by
TjOC.
-
AuthorPosts
-
September 5, 2013 at 7:15 pm #36599
TjOC
ParticipantDia dhaoibh
Tá mé ag déanamh greannán faoi zombaithe. Tá cabhair uaim leis seo:
“You must damage the head. Or they don’t stop.”
“Caithfidh tú damáiste a dhéanamh don cheann. Nó ní stadann siad.”“Then I’ll be preparing for my trip to France.”
“Ansin beidh mé ag ullmhú do mo thuras chun na Fraince.” B’fhéidir “le haghaidh mo thuras..”?Abair liom ceard atá mícheart, le do thoil agus go raibh maith agaibh.
September 5, 2013 at 7:31 pm #44455Lughaidh
Participant“You must damage the head. Or they don’t stop.”
“Caithfidh tú damáiste a dhéanamh don cheann. Nó ní stadann siad.”nò “damàiste a dhèanamh dà gcloigeann” (I think “their head” is better than “the head”)
Instead of “damàiste a dhèanamh” you can also use “gortù” (caithfidh tù a gcloigeann a ghortù).
When you say “you must”, is it a general “you” or is the character talking to one person in particular?
If it’s a general “you”, you can use “caithfear”.“Then I’ll be preparing for my trip to France.”
“Ansin beidh mé ag ullmhú do mo thuras chun na Fraince.” B’fhéidir “le haghaidh mo thuras..”?preparing what? I think “ullmhù” requires a direct object.
I agree with you “le haghaidh mo thurais” or “fà choinne mo thurais”September 5, 2013 at 8:15 pm #44457TjOC
ParticipantGo raibh míle maith agat.
September 6, 2013 at 7:32 am #44458Onuvanja
Participantpreparing what? I think “ullmhù” requires a direct object.
I would say not always. The online version of the new English-Irish dictionary has the following example: to prepare for Christmas ullmhú don Nollaig, ullmhú i gcomhair na Nollag.
So I imagine you could also say “ullmhú don turas chun na Fraince” or alternatively “fáil faoi réir le taisteal chun na Fraince”. Or do you think that would be Béarlachas?September 6, 2013 at 11:21 am #44459Lughaidh
ParticipantIn Ó Dónaill’s dictionary there are examples of ullmhaigh as being both transitive and intransitive, which is a bit strange to me… In Tobar na Gaedhilge all the examples show ullmhaigh as a transitive verb (d’ullmhaigh sé é féin etc).
In Dinneen, it says it’s a transitive verb, but translates it as “I prepare, get ready” (ie. it’s intransitive…) and in the examples it’s transitive.
So it looks that it’s unclear. To me using “ullmhaigh” without a direct object sounds like a Béarlachas… (but I could be mistaken). In the new online dictionary there are many anglicisms so I don’t always trust it.September 6, 2013 at 2:36 pm #44460Dáithí
Participantpreparing what? I think “ullmhù” requires a direct object.
Answer: Myself, which is the implied direct object in the sentence so there’s no need to state it directly.
September 6, 2013 at 2:55 pm #44461Lughaidh
ParticipantAnswer: Myself, which is the implied direct object in the sentence so there’s no need to state it directly.
there’s no “implied direct object”, either there’s a direct object, then it’s a transitive verb, or there’s no direct object, then it’s an intransitive verb.
If the direct object is “myself”, then you’d have “d’ullmhaigh mé mé féin” (and that’s what Tobar na Gaedhilge has).
September 8, 2013 at 9:43 pm #44468Héilics Órbhuí
ParticipantWould “réiteach” or “déanamh réidh” in this context be Anglicisms or is that authentic do you think? I am pretty sure I’ve heard it from “native speakers”, but they aren’t immune to Anglicism.
September 8, 2013 at 10:12 pm #44471Lughaidh
ParticipantFor “réiteach” I don’t know, I have not learnt that meaning (but maybe it does exist).
“A’ déanamh réidh” is very common on Tobar na Gaedhilge so obviously it’s ok.September 8, 2013 at 11:07 pm #44473Héilics Órbhuí
ParticipantI’ve seen things like “réiteach don scrúdú” many times, but again, not sure about its authenticity.
I agree that fáil/déanamh réidh seem like calques, but that doesn’t necessarily mean they’re not authentic. It could simply be parallel evolution, so to speak. I’d be curious to know if there is some sort of actual evidence one way or the other.
September 8, 2013 at 11:07 pm #44474TjOC
ParticipantWould “réiteach” or “déanamh réidh” in this context be Anglicisms or is that authentic do you think? I am pretty sure I’ve heard it from “native speakers”, but they aren’t immune to Anglicism.
Tá sé seo cloiste agam, freisin.
September 9, 2013 at 12:05 am #44475Lughaidh
ParticipantI’ve always thought that “fáilt réidh” and “ag fáilt réidh le” are anglicisms.
“ag fáilt réidh le” just seems like a calque of the English “getting rid of”. “bheith réidh (le rud)” basically means “to be finished (with something)” and hence “ready”.
Profile PMyeah “fáil(t) réidh” but not “déan réidh”. In general I’d say using “faigh” with an adjective is an Anglicism. In Irish you say éirí mór, éirí tinn, or déan thú féin réidh etc, but not faigh + adjective in my opinion.
I’ve seen things like “réiteach don scrúdú” many times, but again, not sure about its authenticity.
réidhteach is very common in Tobar na Gaedhilge, but it looks like it’s transitive (an tábla a réidhteach, an teach a réidhteach…) — not read all the examples, there are too many!
I agree that fáil/déanamh réidh seem like calques, but that doesn’t necessarily mean they’re not authentic. It could simply be parallel evolution, so to speak. I’d be curious to know if there is some sort of actual evidence one way or the other.
fáil réidh (fagháil réidh) has 0 occurrences in Tobar na Gaedhilge, which isn’t a good sign 🙂
September 16, 2013 at 5:41 am #44534TjOC
ParticipantTá mo ghreannán zombaithe thuas anois http://www.occomix.com/blog/2013/09/na-zombaithe-an-chead/
Go raibh maith agaibh arís.
-
AuthorPosts
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.